That's all good for people just looking at the money standpoint.

Some of us actually want to help reduce dependence on oil, and do our part to clean up the planet. Hybrids aren't all about saving money. It's also about the "green" side of things.

*sigh* I just ripped my brother-in-law a new one for trying to argue that I should have bought the XLE V6 for the same price. Then again, he's the type that needs an 8-Passenger, V10, 9MPG Earth Raper for his family of 4, that he drives ALONE to work 45 miles each day.

 

I had salesmen at two of the larger local Toyota dealers give me the same lecture about "...you have to drive 200,000 miles in your TCH to get enough fuel savings to make up the difference in cost between a TCH and non-hybrid Camry....". I told them I was not interested in buying a Camry because it's a Camry, but buying a Camry hybrid because it's a hybrid.

I asked them both: "if it is such a great deal to buy a base Camry instead of a hybrid Camry then why do you have more than two dozen base Camry's (including some '08 models) rotting on your lot and not one hybrid Camry? Are your customers stupid, or....maybe there is a reason a customer might want a hybrid?"

...a moment of awkward silence ensued...

They obviously want to sell what they have on the lot and especially what's been sitting around a long time. Even after I made it clear I was only interested in an '09 TCH one of the dealers expended more effort trying to sell me (after the base Camry pitch) a Corolla and a RAV4 than making any attempt to accommodate my clearly stated desire for nothing but an '09 TCH.

I ended up buying my '09 TCH at a small-town dealer about 30 miles from where I live where they don't waste your time trying to sell you something else other than what you said you wanted when you walked on the lot. I paid MSRP and got a good value on my Nissan Frontier trade-in.

 

For most it is largely about the money. The 'green' side of it is just an added benefit/bonus, or to be 'green' cannot be an unreasonable premium, where what is reasonable is very subjective.

For me, the mileage was the part which drew me to the TCH, but at the end of the day I still had to pay for it. If my ability to pay did not match the cost then I wouldn't have done it no matter how much I liked the technology or its 'greeness'.

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Toronto, ON. I purchased my TCH from one of the largest dealer in the country(what they told me anyways). Bought it on July 19th and took them 3 day to locate one for me. The dealer told me there is a much longer wait time on Prius cause the demand is higher and it's still be made in Japan and shipped over. I managed to get ~$1200 off the total price. I think what deal you can get and how long you have to wait, all depends where you are and where you're buying from. I think you already got that from other's reply. Good luck!

 

Hey LL,

I bought my '09 TCH from Charlesglen Toyota in the NW. I live out in the foothills west of the city. Ordered it on May 12th, and they said about a month or more wait. I picked it up, suprisingly, on May 24th (Vic. Day).

My dealer was pretty honest about what was what - the dealership sold 14 Prius' and something like 6 TCH's in the 1-2 weeks before we got serious about purchasing. On the Thursday before we put a downpayment down (which was on the 12th) we test drove the TCH for the first time, fell in love with it, and our dealer looked into what was available in Calgary ('on the ground') - only 3 Prius' and 2 TCHs. None of those fit with what we wanted.

Also, we had to wait to get into the TCH since there were 2 couples ahead of us wanting to test drive it too. The Prius was booked the whole day, it seemed, so we didn't even ask about it...

In the end, we ordered the '09 TCH with our parameters, waited not very long, and got one a mere two weeks later. August, gas prices, demand, battery supply, etc., has really sparked an interest in ALL hybrids, so I think that if you can wait, it'll be worth it (getting between 4.9-5.4L/100km in the summer).

I haven't been overly excited about driving anywhere anytime in the last decade or so. The fact that I'm posting to a forum about the TCH says volumes about how the car has performed and lived up to it's 'green' potential...

 

I don't think so. If it was about money, then those buyers would be in a Yaris, Echo, Civic, or one of the many Kia's that are 30+ mpg. If it was just about the tech stuff, the Prius will get you the same, if not a little more (backup camera, EV mode hack, etc...) and save you at leas $5k.

For me, it was about a good sized car, and doing my part to help clean up the world. If it was just about the money, the Prius is actually more usable for a family (about the same seating room, bigger trunk) and it's better MPG, lower price. But my wife and I were unwilling to "stand out" that much.

 

I think we agree more than disagree, its just that we are coming at it from different sides. I wanted a vehicle that my soon to be teenagers can ride in the back seat comfortably. That eliminated all the Yaris sized vehicles and left me in the Camry/Altima/Accord/??? sizes. From there it is about what one can and is willing to afford.

When I said that people are willing to spend a reasonable premium to be 'green', that number will vary. Even if you want to do the best for the environment how much of a premium would you pay for the TCH? We all paid at least 2K more than a comparably equipped gas Camry, but how many would have paid 10K more? 20K more? No matter how much I want to save the planet, a 20K premium for a hybrid would have been a complete non-starter for me. I'm sure you have a price point at which you also would not have done it.

 

There is clearly a price at which every hybrid owner would not have chosen a hybrid. However, most current hybrid owners are certainly willing to pay more for the hybrid, even if the eventual gas savings never offsets the initial price premium.

However, I think people tend to calculate the total gas savings incorrectly. Most people look at the gas saved over 3 or 4 years, but if you are buying the car, you must look at the gas savings over the life of the car, and for a camry, that can easily be over 10 years and/or 200,000. It does not matter if YOU will be the owner who actually drives the car into the ground, but someone will be, and the guy who buys the car off of you will be able to factor in his estimated gas savings and pay you more for your used car. Put another way, the fact that you are buying a hybrid means that you will be able to sell your car for considerably more at the back end. The more the price of gas increases, the more of a premium your car will be worth. So if after 6 years gas is at $10 a gallon (and there is really no reason why it would not be at least that much) your car will be worth FAR more than a comparable used V6XLE. So what ever more you pay now you will almost certainly get back when you sell your car, all of the money saved on gas along the way is just bonus!

 

(Northern VA) I ran into my saleswoman at local grocery store last week--she actually recognized me two years later! Anyway, she asked me, half-jokingly, if I wanted to sell my 2007 TCH. She told me I could get more than I paid for it! In fact, she told me she just sold a 2007 Prius, package #2, with 33K miles on it for just over $28K!

She went on to say that the wait for the TCH is about 3 months, the Prius closer to 6 months. Her new dealership is selling them at MSRP only. They're not trying to price gouge, at least on new models.

Of course, I think this area has more "green people" than many other areas of this country, except California. I imagine you could get one sooner in other areas of the country, but you will likely end up paying pretty close to sticker price.

 

Putting it that way, yes. I agree. I paid about $3k more for Hybrid over the standard. That was worth it to me. Looking at the gas alone, I will save about $1200 a year over my Bora. And I can feel good about it.

As for the Green people in California... This is an Odd bunch of people. Half of us want to save the planet. The other half doesn't care at all.

For every Hybrid I see on the road, I'm sure to find at least 2 SUV's near by. And **** do those SUV drivers hate us!