Here is another example (posting #2): "I commute about 15km each way- I rarely reach 100km either way- so, I could potentially drive completely on electric Monday to Friday. If this is true, I would be filling up once every few months. Unbelievable."

My first posting was a result of this kind of statement. What difference does it make who burns the fossil fuel? You or the power plant? Electricity comes from somewhere. It doesn't fall down from the sky. This becomes a completely different animal when we have replaced our fossil fuel based power plants. But as of TODAY there is no gain by driving electrical.

 

I'm pretty sure if you live near places like Niagara Falls, Hoover Dam, or Iceland you'll definitely gain an advantage TODAY by going electrical. Or if you already live in a house like that doctor from St. Elsewhere or Bill Nye you'll gain TODAY (in fact according the Nightline short the St. Elsewhere guy already drives an electric car.)

Even if you live in a place totally powered by coal you may be making more efficient use of the pollution by soaking up excess capacity at night by charging your car. Coal plants don't start up on a dime and often just keep on burning through the night even though no one is using all that energy.

Also I think you're looking at this way too short term. It takes 11 years to turn over the fleet by 50%. So while there may be no difference in pollution now, is it worth the investment to go ahead with plug-ins now in hopes that when cleaner sources come on-line we can benefit immediately or wait the 11 or so years later to get 50% of the benefit? I say it makes sense to go ahead right now.

 

I'm second to thansen.
The plug-in hybrid is not cleaner than hybrid Prius.

https://www.greenhybrid.com/discuss/140004-post15.html
CO2 emissions are...
conventional vehicle: 500g/mile
PHEV-20: 190g/mile
Prius: 167g/mile

Ken@Japan

 

Granted, I'm not an engineer, but what would stop Toyota from using regular NiMH cells for the main battery and LiIon cells for the PHEV battery? Then the lithium cells could be charged safely from household current while the nickel cells could take the more abusive Regen charge that occurs when driving.

 

Nothing but cost IMO

 

I'd say we are "moving forward" with electrical transport...it is already heading to the alternative/renewable/clean sources. Gasoline is surely NOT moving towards alternative/renewable/clean sources!

electricity to power cars is not dirtier than gasoline and has so much more potential to be cleaner.

It isn't rocket science to produce clean electricity...it is fantasy to produce clean gasoline.

 

I agree, even a coal plant can produce a mile of propulsion cleaner than the gas engine in a car.

Ethanol, hydrogen, natural gas are all clean, only diesel is as dirty or dirtier than gas.

We do nee a lot of prodress,

1. Larger watt hour storage batteries on board,
2. Higher speeds for battery operaeration on hybrides.
3. More efficient batteries NiMH will not cut it.
4. Plugs.

The volt while failing in all other areas at lease has a longer battery only range.

 

In the USA, on average around 600 grammes of CO2 are released per kWh of electricity produced (table 4 here).

An EV or PHEV can go about 5 miles per kWh of electricity, so that's 120 g CO2 per kWh using today's electricity production mix. (It will be less in future with more nuclear or renewables).

EV / PHEV - 120 g / mile
Polo bluemotion - 159 g / mile
Prius - 167 g / mile

 

Why to go CLETT

They are actually all quite good if you compared them to a standard gas car.