Hi,

Sorry, this is a long post, but rich with detail to let you know as much as possible. Please read and let me know if you have a comment. I’m a mechanical engineer, but I don’t work in the automotive industry. I know what I’m doing while maintaining the car, but I’m not an expert on automobiles.

I bought a 2007 HCH at the end of Nov. 2007, brand new with ~150 miles. During my first year of ownership, the car wasn’t driven much, so the oil was changed at about one year because the owner’s manual says to change it at one year, regardless of what the Maintenance Minder says. (Refer to Note 1 to Maintenance Main Items on Page 185 of 2007 Owner’s Manual. Honda also says to not change the factory oil until the Maintenance Minder says to change it, but the dealer said to follow the one-year rule.) In Dec. 2008 with ~4,500 miles and 50% oil life, the car had its first oil change, and it was performed by a Honda dealership. The car was still new and hybrids are new technology, so I wanted Honda hands on it for the first oil change.

In Oct. 2009, I personally changed the oil on the car at ~11,750 miles (~7,250 since oil change) and 15% on oil life. (I used Honda 0W-20, new Honda oil filter, and new oil drain plug washer. I have my receipts. I used a torque wrench to tighten bolt. I’m not messing with my warranty. Maintenance Minder asked for and received B1 service.) Anyhow, I was distressed to see what appears to be oil leaking from somewhere between the engine, IMA, and/or CVT. Take a look at the attached pictures. The first picture is the best of the leak. It’s taken looking from driver to passenger side of the car. The second picture was taken looking up along the front side of the engine/IMA, which is to the left in the first picture. You’ll notice the orange plastic that is visible in both pictures.

The fluid was yellow (and looks yellow in the first picture), so it’s not CVT fluid, which would be pink (right?). I found it to be good news that the removed plastic shield that fits under the engine was dry with no sign of oil, so I believe that everything that leaked is in the picture or inside the IMA housing. A possible clue: I slightly suspect that I may have drained more oil from the car than the 3.4 quarts that the car is supposed to take. The oil never seemed over filled when checking the dipstick, but maybe it was.

Anyhow, I took pictures of the oil leak, wiped it clean, and then took the car to a local Honda dealer, but different than the guys who did the Dec. 2008 oil change.
*They looked at the car in Oct. 2009 at ~12,000 miles (~250 miles since oil change), saw no oil, and added a dye to the oil.
*They looked at it again three weeks later at ~12,600 miles (~850 since oil change) and still no oil visible with naked eye or with black light or whatever they used for the dye.
*Honda took a look at the car again for a different reason in March 2010 at ~14,900 miles (~3,150 miles since oil change), and no oil was visible to the naked eye. Maybe the leak has gone away…
*Oil on dipstick has been on full mark every time that I’ve checked. I will do my next oil change when Maintenance Minder tells me that it’s necessary, but I haven’t personally looked at it since Oct. 2009. I will be very curious to see how it looks after ~7,500+ miles since the last oil change.

What do you think happened? In March, the local Honda dealer thought it might have been left over from an oil change. I strongly doubt this. The engine was dry around the drain plug and around the oil filter. It’s not a coincidence to me that the oil is along the seam between the engine and the IMA.

A thought is that if there was more than 3.4 quarts of oil in the engine, then it might have developed high pressure and forced oil past the seal between the engine and the powertrain. Anyone agree? If so, do you think this leak is a non-issue after draining and then correctly filling the engine with oil?

Do you think the problem might have been caused by the Honda dealer who changed the oil in Dec. 2008 using 5W-30 or something else? My receipt says 0W-20 oil, filter, and drain plug washer, but you never know.

Thoughts? Anybody else seen this? Anybody have any idea what the cause is/was? Need more information from me?

If you were me, is there anything you would do while the car is under warranty? In case this leak doesn’t become a major problem for a few years, is there anything that you would do to make a case for good-will assistance from Honda after warranty expiration? I’m worried that the IMA or CVT is or will be damaged because of the leak, but not show the damage until after my warranty has expired.

Thank you for reading, and thank you for any assistance!

 

I'm still not quite clear on the pictures, but suspect the second one is at the junction between the engine block and transmission, at the front vertical face of engine. I can just see a similar bar code looking at mine, through a forest of hoses.

My hunch is you have a minor amount of transmission fluid leaking, at the mating surface between transmission and engine, as evidenced in the second picture. It migrates down to the underside, as you see in the first picture.

I forget the CVT fluid color. I've changed ours twice, but just can't recall: it might just be a golden, oil color. You can check by wiping the CVT dipstick off on a clean white cloth. Have you checked CVT fluid level? I would suggest to check it when the engine is cold, and use the cold side of the dipstick.

There is a hot check procedure described in both the Owners and Service manuals, but it never works for me. The refill amount is 3 us quarts. I use that amount, and it comes to full mark on cold side, with cold engine.

With past Honda vehicles, I've had minor leaks from oil pans, and sometimes from crankshaft seals. The latter are more problematic, they tend to get worse. Likely in your case there is a slight leak at that mating surface, maybe just around one bolt.

If you're not seeing oil on the plastic undershield it can't be a lot. I'd just keep an eye on both CVT and engine oil levels, as you're doing.

 

Any updates on this?

 

Thanks, Mendel Leisk, for the suggestion about checking the CVT. I checked the CVT level while cold, and the level was at, maybe just below, the upper limit. It's not low, so I can't definitively say that the CVT fluid has been leaking.

Regarding the color, the CVT fluid appeared clear, maybe slightly tan/yellow, while on the dipstick, which is what atikovi noticed: https://www.greenhybrid.com/discuss/f12/cvt-transmission-fluid-flush-what-color-your-fluid-11466/. Honda told me that it's pink, but the CVT fluid is not pink; it is clear/tan/maybe slightly yellow.

However, I do have an interesting observation. It's clear/slightly tan/slightly yellow while on the dipstick, but it appeared pinkish in places on the napkin that I used. I used a white napkin so that I could see the color. Check out the attached picture (yes, it may be a new low; a picture of trash), but you can see yellowish color in places and also pink in others. Anybody have any idea why this happened? Something on the napkin? Something in the fluid? The napkin was clean, and it was not used to wipe or check anything else while under the hood.

So, what's new is that it may be CVT fluid. I'm not certain what leaked; I think it was oil, but it could be CVT fluid. Both oil and CVT dipsticks indicate full, or nearly full. At this point, I may not get anymore clues until my next oil change at which time I will get a good look underneath.

Thoughts? Anybody else seen a leak like this?

 

Noticed something in the news on this:

http://www.dispatch.com/live/content...y.html?sid=101

It looks like Honda is getting a lot of coolant leak reports with this gen. of Civic, so has extended warranty on this issue, to 8 years and unlimited mileage.

 

Hello guys I was reading your forms and the other day when my oil light came on with code A1 I had driven it a little bit and I usually take it to my dealer for fluid changes and what not but being short on cash I have done my last two oil changes my self no problems at all well with this last one I had noticed a bad flapping noise before the oil change I checked everything oil was,kinda ok cvt was kinda low so I put some,fluid in that still hearing this flapping noise I checked the fluids again after a few days of just doing it it was fine so last night I'm on a short road trip and the noise is still there but worse this time the 07 hch won't speed up won't shift right almost dead in the water so I got more fluids out them in and it was kinda alright . but this morning on my way home,from picking up my kiddo we get home and I smell burning fluids probably from my over spill . so I look under the car and there is tranny fluid in the ground all over the underbody of the car I've checked for leaks but don't see any .. Any ideas on what I should do or can do to help fix this problem ?