Dealer Greed Tax
#11
Re: Dealer Greed Tax
Discussions:
3000 tax credit qualifications ?
Form 8910 - Any idea when it will be ready?
And this quote -- supporting the supporting the purchase date theory as opposed to the order date theory -- from the IRS tax form instructions, under the What's New section: "Ford and Mercury vehicles purchased after March 31, 2009, qualify for a reduced credit."
Ref:
http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/i8910.pdf
http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f8910.pdf
#12
Re: Dealer Greed Tax
WOW! I don't like that form. In previous years the instructions included --
"Summary of the Credit for Qualified Hybrid Vehicles
Notice 2006-78 announced the credit phase out schedule for advanced lean burn technology vehicles and hybrid vehicles manufactured by Toyota Motor Sales USA, Inc. (Toyota and Lexus vehicles). For the period of 10-1-06 to 3-31-07, purchasers of qualifying vehicles are eligible for 50% of the allowable credit. For the period of 4-1-07 to 9-30-07, purchasers of qualifying vehicles are eligible for 25% of the allowable credit. The table below includes both the full credit and the reduced credit amount depending upon when the vehicle was purchased.
The date of purchase determines the amount of the credit available for a vehicle, i.e. whether a vehicle is eligible for the full credit or whether a portion of the credit is phased-out. The placed in service date determines the taxable year in which the credit may be claimed.
For example, if consumer A purchases a Prius on Sept. 30, 2006, and takes possession in February 2007, consumer A can claim the full credit for 2007, the year in which the vehicle is placed in service. "
This meant that they considered the act of ordering the qualifier for the incentive amount. The date of possession defined the year in which the incentive could be claimed.
If this has been changed for 2008, there will be a lot of P'd people. Ford appeared to be operating under the same understanding of the rulings - order by 3/31 and take the full credit.
My claim form in Turbo-Tax for 2008 includes the provision for "Purchase" date and "Inservice" date. I can't believe this fight is over yet.
"Summary of the Credit for Qualified Hybrid Vehicles
Notice 2006-78 announced the credit phase out schedule for advanced lean burn technology vehicles and hybrid vehicles manufactured by Toyota Motor Sales USA, Inc. (Toyota and Lexus vehicles). For the period of 10-1-06 to 3-31-07, purchasers of qualifying vehicles are eligible for 50% of the allowable credit. For the period of 4-1-07 to 9-30-07, purchasers of qualifying vehicles are eligible for 25% of the allowable credit. The table below includes both the full credit and the reduced credit amount depending upon when the vehicle was purchased.
The date of purchase determines the amount of the credit available for a vehicle, i.e. whether a vehicle is eligible for the full credit or whether a portion of the credit is phased-out. The placed in service date determines the taxable year in which the credit may be claimed.
For example, if consumer A purchases a Prius on Sept. 30, 2006, and takes possession in February 2007, consumer A can claim the full credit for 2007, the year in which the vehicle is placed in service. "
This meant that they considered the act of ordering the qualifier for the incentive amount. The date of possession defined the year in which the incentive could be claimed.
If this has been changed for 2008, there will be a lot of P'd people. Ford appeared to be operating under the same understanding of the rulings - order by 3/31 and take the full credit.
My claim form in Turbo-Tax for 2008 includes the provision for "Purchase" date and "Inservice" date. I can't believe this fight is over yet.
#13
Re: Dealer Greed Tax
This meant that they considered the act of ordering the qualifier for the incentive amount. The date of possession defined the year in which the incentive could be claimed.
If this has been changed for 2008, there will be a lot of P'd people. Ford appeared to be operating under the same understanding of the rulings - order by 3/31 and take the full credit.
My claim form in Turbo-Tax for 2008 includes the provision for "Purchase" date and "Inservice" date. I can't believe this fight is over yet.
If this has been changed for 2008, there will be a lot of P'd people. Ford appeared to be operating under the same understanding of the rulings - order by 3/31 and take the full credit.
My claim form in Turbo-Tax for 2008 includes the provision for "Purchase" date and "Inservice" date. I can't believe this fight is over yet.
#14
Re: Dealer Greed Tax
I've been following the FEH/MMH, and anyone putting their purchase in service by March 31, 2009 will get the full credit. After that it is reduced, but still available.
Look on the irs.gov website for info on the FFH. I saw 2010 MY it listed somewhere as $3,400 credit available.
#15
Re: Dealer Greed Tax
Folks,
Two things to keep in mind:
Doberwiler
Two things to keep in mind:
- AMT may make it impossible for you to get the credit -- this happened to me when I bought a HCH two years ago. Many people don't understand this.
- The dealer greed will go down shortly. Don't pay invoice -- wait a bit. In a few months you should be able to get one for dealer invoice + $200 especially if the economy stays the same.
Doberwiler
#16
Re: Dealer Greed Tax
I have leased cars for business reasons since 1984. My leasing guy could get me a FFH for "invoice" and was willing to pass it on to me at that price in a lease. The leasing company was required to take the credit, though, and could not pass it on to me. Naturally, he didn't want to reduce the capitalized cost based on a refund he'd not get for a year and that required special tax forms to be filed.
I wanted to own it anyway, so started calling around. I told them that my leasing guy could get the car, which was an advantage for leasing, but that I wanted to own it. (True!) So that put a target on the price I was able to get, and I think that they knew it was true. Get close to invoice or not get the deal. Everybody in town (larger town, several dealers in the metro area) was at sticker or above in mid March and said that if I thought that was not a good deal, go elsewhere. So I went online, found all the Ford dealers in the state and started calling in the areas where the unemployment was 17% or above. Guess what: I bought at $200 over invoice. Not bad, and the dealer was even glad to get my business! I confirmed their definition of "invoice" before making the drive, and it took 5 minutes to write up the deal when I got there. It could not have been easier.
I did have one dealer call me back (only one!) and offer me the car at $500 over invoice. I told him that he was high (literally and figuratively!) and that I didn't mind driving 100 miles to get a better deal. He seemed disappointed that I'd been successful. Maybe unemployment will next strike where he works. I'd feel bad about leaving them no profit except for the fact that "invoice" is fabricated anyway, even including an advertising credit of $500 (!), plus holdbacks and other games. They did OK on it.
Bob
I wanted to own it anyway, so started calling around. I told them that my leasing guy could get the car, which was an advantage for leasing, but that I wanted to own it. (True!) So that put a target on the price I was able to get, and I think that they knew it was true. Get close to invoice or not get the deal. Everybody in town (larger town, several dealers in the metro area) was at sticker or above in mid March and said that if I thought that was not a good deal, go elsewhere. So I went online, found all the Ford dealers in the state and started calling in the areas where the unemployment was 17% or above. Guess what: I bought at $200 over invoice. Not bad, and the dealer was even glad to get my business! I confirmed their definition of "invoice" before making the drive, and it took 5 minutes to write up the deal when I got there. It could not have been easier.
I did have one dealer call me back (only one!) and offer me the car at $500 over invoice. I told him that he was high (literally and figuratively!) and that I didn't mind driving 100 miles to get a better deal. He seemed disappointed that I'd been successful. Maybe unemployment will next strike where he works. I'd feel bad about leaving them no profit except for the fact that "invoice" is fabricated anyway, even including an advertising credit of $500 (!), plus holdbacks and other games. They did OK on it.
Bob
#17
Re: Dealer Greed Tax
I did not buy a FFH yet, but I was able to get a few dealers in MA to agree to true dealer cost + 500. That would be invoice - holdback + 500. I didn't try to get any lower but probably will when I go to buy the car.
I have leased cars for business reasons since 1984. My leasing guy could get me a FFH for "invoice" and was willing to pass it on to me at that price in a lease. The leasing company was required to take the credit, though, and could not pass it on to me. Naturally, he didn't want to reduce the capitalized cost based on a refund he'd not get for a year and that required special tax forms to be filed.
I wanted to own it anyway, so started calling around. I told them that my leasing guy could get the car, which was an advantage for leasing, but that I wanted to own it. (True!) So that put a target on the price I was able to get, and I think that they knew it was true. Get close to invoice or not get the deal. Everybody in town (larger town, several dealers in the metro area) was at sticker or above in mid March and said that if I thought that was not a good deal, go elsewhere. So I went online, found all the Ford dealers in the state and started calling in the areas where the unemployment was 17% or above. Guess what: I bought at $200 over invoice. Not bad, and the dealer was even glad to get my business! I confirmed their definition of "invoice" before making the drive, and it took 5 minutes to write up the deal when I got there. It could not have been easier.
I did have one dealer call me back (only one!) and offer me the car at $500 over invoice. I told him that he was high (literally and figuratively!) and that I didn't mind driving 100 miles to get a better deal. He seemed disappointed that I'd been successful. Maybe unemployment will next strike where he works. I'd feel bad about leaving them no profit except for the fact that "invoice" is fabricated anyway, even including an advertising credit of $500 (!), plus holdbacks and other games. They did OK on it.
Bob
I wanted to own it anyway, so started calling around. I told them that my leasing guy could get the car, which was an advantage for leasing, but that I wanted to own it. (True!) So that put a target on the price I was able to get, and I think that they knew it was true. Get close to invoice or not get the deal. Everybody in town (larger town, several dealers in the metro area) was at sticker or above in mid March and said that if I thought that was not a good deal, go elsewhere. So I went online, found all the Ford dealers in the state and started calling in the areas where the unemployment was 17% or above. Guess what: I bought at $200 over invoice. Not bad, and the dealer was even glad to get my business! I confirmed their definition of "invoice" before making the drive, and it took 5 minutes to write up the deal when I got there. It could not have been easier.
I did have one dealer call me back (only one!) and offer me the car at $500 over invoice. I told him that he was high (literally and figuratively!) and that I didn't mind driving 100 miles to get a better deal. He seemed disappointed that I'd been successful. Maybe unemployment will next strike where he works. I'd feel bad about leaving them no profit except for the fact that "invoice" is fabricated anyway, even including an advertising credit of $500 (!), plus holdbacks and other games. They did OK on it.
Bob
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