Uh... Yeah, I was. Steve - How the heck did we suddenly end up on the opposite side of the fence? We were arguing the same point. Thanks for all that evidence by the way! That's some pretty darn good stuff! I am as sold on the reliability and engineering of the FEH as I could possibly be. In fact, I think your post has made me even more so.

Please re-read the past few days of posts and I think you'll see what I mean.

 

This discussion reminds me of the Porsche EXPLODING rubber clutch episode back in the early eighties. Having had one myself, a '78 Targa, EXPLODED at only 38,000 miles, I was fully aware of the problem. But get anyone in the Porsche community, dealer, aftermarket shops included, to discuss the issue openly, NO WAY, Porsche would NEVER commit such a sin.

"Porsche can do no wrong..!"

Then in '83 Porsche dropped the rubber center clutch, admitted the reason, and suddenly the issue could be discussed, admitted, openly.

 

lol. well put. I think Bill should go run for office..again. i think Vernal Utah needs a dog catcher. He would tell cavemen they did the wheel all wrong and left out a rock then proceed to add one and tell them his rock wheel was superior. lol.

 

One thing I've been wondering about.

Back in the early 2000's many of the people over at InsightCentral.net were promoting the WOT technique, and apparently some had used it for years, at least until 2005.

The description can be found here under the title "Use Full-Throttle Acceleration":
http://www.insightcentral.net/KB/faq...l#acceleration

Basically, it's going wide open throttle to accelerate quickly up to cruising speed then feathering back. The procedure was used both coming off a stop- ICE off or ICE on and flooring it.

I tried the technique maybe 2-3 times many years ago in my HCH1 but quit because (1) it seemed like a lot of uneccessary stress was placed on the entire drive train and (2) it proved terrible for efficiency. I had found that a slow but deliberate, moderate acceleration was proven to be most efficient in my own vehicle.

I was never sold on the theory that WOT in an automobile would overcome any pumping loss effects. I'd be curious to know how their cars held up (Or not held up)

 

I do a moderate acceleration in all my cars and feather back also or begin a P&G. Many times I'll come out of EV mode to the floor to make a stoplight also. With MG2 Assist, I'm not worried because the manual oil pump begins to get oil to the bearings while MG1 is starting the engine at a rapid spin-up.

Now, when the engine is first started after sitting for awhile, MG2 provides the torque until emissions are handled better by the CAT. The timing is retarded by the PCM during the first start-up in the FEH. Most of the energy is coming right out of that big 330V battery in both Assist and first start-up after sitting. This is why those cabbies drive like hell and get 300,000 miles before their made to retire those vehicles to us normal drivers. They drive the Crown Vics the same way because they can get new parts all they want. At least, that was what the cabbies told me recently while staying in Manhattan. My Son, his girlfriend, and my wife sat in the back while I sat in the front of the cabs and talked to the cabbies about their vehicles.

GaryG

 

But again, do those cabbies really know, or care about, the maintenance history/record of the vehicle, in some cases the particular vehicle they were given to drive that day.

 

I wouldn't think it is their job to keep records, but they know how many times the vehicles breakdown for repairs and need a replacement to drive during their shift. I was part of a large Fire Department and we had a separate division called Support Services like I'm sure the NYC Cab Companies have also. Support Services had a fleet of older vehicles that were for replacements when a car, vehicle or truck would breakdown or is due for service. Most of the drivers had to go to Support Services to get a replacement and return the replacement after their unit was repaired, serviced or replaced. There are no new replacements in these older fleets just sitting around not making money, those are on the road. The drivers prefer to drive the working fleet and will complain if their vehicle is taking to long to fix. Word gets around about the problems of certain vehicles real fast, and if there are serious repair problems, Support Services will make a change in the vehicles their purchasing. I heard no complaints when I was asking about their FEH.

GaryG

 

I haven't read any of the responses to my original post (I'm at work & don't have time to wade through all the back & forth).

I do IT work for a large auto dealership & was also a flat-rate auto line mechanic in my younger days. One of our service techs used to work for a Ford dealer and told me that these engines letting go like this is not a real common problem but certainly not all that rare either.

He personally saw three cases of FEH's with the exact same problem in his time with Ford.

I found a used engine from one of our sources with 60,000 miles on it for $2200 & installed it myself (I have an engine hoist, hand tools, welders etc. in my home garage) so the thing is running again but I'm not sure if I will keep it or not at this point.

~John

 

Thanks for the update. If I had this same thing happen I would look to do the same thing (salvaged engine) as it seems like the most reasonable option. Glad to know you were able to do it yourself as well. Lots of discussion on this topic... Kind of started a small storm of theories and debates actually. Of course we're all hoping this is as rare as hens teeth but the moment anyone says it can't happen to them... Knock on wood! Did you ever look into the notion of attempting to open up the bottom end and fix the problem? It's always a risky thing because it's so difficult to know what caused it in the first place. The crank journal may have sustained damage as well. I have no idea how tough it would be to do surgery on one of these but my dad talks about "rolling in a new bearing" on many engines in his days of wrenching for a living. It wasn't all that long ago that this was a common occurrence in automotive shops. Any more we seem to have a replacement philosophy rather than a fixing it. I suppose it comes down to dollars and cents at some point. Hopefully you're all set for many miles of driving now.

 

Glad to hear you got it sorted John, you were a regular contributor when I was all new to my '07. Seems like a rare occurrence, ie, the Friday build, or whatever. Anyhoots, seems like you have enough invested to just drive it, make sure it's all good and then sell it. What is the legal disclosure on a vehicle with a swap-in motor? I assume since it's private owner sale, then it's "as-is" with no further ramifications on you part.

I used to do this with my race car built motors and it was assumed that it might blow up in 30 minutes or 30 days. that was assumed by the buyer.

oh. btw. which bearing failed?