Hi John, I have a 2008 FEH and just tried what you described. I was going over 50MPH and started down a 7% hill, I shifted to L and let off the gas, all that I observed was a lot of re-gen, the tach stayed at 1500rpm. After 5 sec, I shifted back to D and kept foot off the gas. Tach stayed at 1500RPM with slight regen. At the bottom of the hill, I was still over 55MPH but I don't know if I accomplished the fuel cut-off you described.

I wonder if the new software they use in the 08's is the difference?

Some other differences I have observed:
1) I hve been unable to use the "double tap" technique to get it to
go into EV quicker. But I have observed that it seems to go into EV
easier when I am using L vs. D.

2) On the energy flow panel, I sometimes observed an energy flow from
the battery thru the motor to the ICE, which I believe happens when
you need to bleed excess charge from the battery, however when this
happens, I do not see the tach RPMs increase that others have
reported.

Just curious if this is all software changes with the 08's, or does my vehicle have a problem?

Thanks, Ken

 

I think that this info maybe explains why some people don't get any battery-PID xgauges. The SG isn't waiting long enough for a response to the PID request.

The Tav xgauge on my FEH reads exactly the same as the instrument cluster diagnostic battery temp. The BTM xgauge doesn't update regularly when below 60F, but seems to catch up once above that. BTM is called battery air temp, while the Tav is the average temperature of the battery modules. Apparently, some people still don't understand the xgauge and PID concept, but at this point I don't know any better way to explain it.

 

GPSMAN1 - John, I agree. My 08 FEH AWD has NEVER displayed the HV Batt Temp. I believe the 08 PID is different, and we don't know the answer. I would certainly like to know by spring/summer.

Fuel Cutoff - Slight different subject, but something that you are familar with. I observed something VERY interesting yesterday driving my 96 Ford Explorer (4.0L gas, 4WD automatic) from Louisville to Raleigh (580 miles). My Son is the new owner, and I flew back home today. The 08 FEH replaces the 96 Explorer. I naturally used my SGII the entire trip. After owning this car all these years, didn't realize that 'Fuel Cutoff' exists on the Explorer just like the FEH hybrid. At approx 60 or so MPH, releasing the gas pedal allows Fuel Cut Off (FCO) in about 2 seconds. Monitoring instantaneous MPG and GPH reveals 9999 and 0 respectively. There is a considerable braking action from the engine, and keeps the downhill speed in check w/o using the brake. Being a natural skeptic, I already had the Ford PWM protocol Fuel Pump Pulse Width Bank 1 and 2 programmed in the SGII (FP1) & (FP2). While driving at 60mph on flat road, both FP1 and FP2 showed ~1500 counts (whatever that means). Both went up while accelerating, and down during a slower speed idle or downhill with foot still on accelerator. Just what you would expect, meaning the fuel pump is pumping more/less fuel depending on requirement.

But during the Fuel cutoff anomaly, FP1 and FP2 also go to ZERO, as well as GPH. ZERO fuel is used in this situation, and I had this car all these years, and didn't realize the benefit or existance of Fuel Cut Off. Bummer. A very slight touch of the accelerator restored readings to GPH and FP1/FP2. Placing the gearship into neutral showed minimal GHP and low FP1/FP2 (900), but proved that leaving the tranny in drive and keeping the foot off the accelerator while descending a hill can provide tremendous improvements in FE on the Ford Explorer, as well as the FEH.

I averaged 24.85 MPH for the entire trip, which included moderate mountain driving up to 3500 feet from the nominal 500ft. altitude here. Utilized all the tricks I've learned, and proved even a Ford Explorer 4.0L gas engine 4WD on a truck chassis can get decent FE if driven gently.

Fuel economy is obtainable on ANY vehicle -> accelerate like there's an egg under your foot, coast every chance you get, and drive at no more than 60, and feather the pedal uphill to maintain good instantaneous FE while losing speed. Going down the other side, you can gently accelerate to a relatively high speed to make the next hill with gentle pedal. It's a mental approach. Now imagine what the hybrid Escape can do , even in the cold weather.

 

Great Post Ken!

Yes, I knew other "newer" nonhybrid cars did fuel cut when "coasting".
If you can run a v8 on 4 when crusing, why not use zero when "coasting"?
I just didn't know something as far back as 1996 did that.

I rented a 2007 Ford Fusion not too long ago.
It had the same I4 engine ( regular, not Atkinsen ) and behaved just like the FEH, and your other car.

BTW, I was getting 37 MPG in the I4 Ford Fusion.... not a Hybrid... with all highway driving at ~ 60-65 MPH.

Carl, I didn't realize the Tav was working better.
I hadn't tried that one yet.

 

Not the best mountain vehicle. We regularly drive I-80 East to see Natalie's folks on the rez. one section, about 10 miles at 6-8% grade our FEH struggles. I shift to low but it doesn't seem to help much. i just drive in the truckers lane and take my time.

 

GPSMAN1 - John, one more comment on Fuel Cutoff, on my 2002 Ford Ranger, 3.0L, 5sp Manual. Monitoring SGII-Xgauge MGP, GPH, and FP1, I see a reduced fuel consumption coasting from at speed down to 20mph in 5th gear vs. engaging clutch (neutral). GPH and Fuel Pump Pulse Width (FP1) provide a constant correlation, and both are about half that of coasting in neutral. What does this mean?? It's better in this vehicle to coast in 5th gear than shifting into neutral or engaging clutch. My old 96' Explorer exhibited a 100% fuel cutoff, but the Ranger only shows improvement, but not total cutoff.

Boy, what we have learned with the SGII. Practically all fuel saving tricks apply to all vehicles. Now if my wife would just let me drive the FEH AWD more often, I could report more on it. Meanwhile, I can say that COLD weather is causing a 20% or more drop in her FE. But then she likes the heater, Tunes on the radio, and Heated seats

 

Coasting "in gear" causes the engine to bog down to a lower RPM.
Since you are coasting, and not making horsepower, the lower RPM = fewer pulses of fuel per second = higher MPG.

The FEH will do the same thing.
If you don't get fuel cut, coasting in D will show higher MPG than coasting in N. In N the engine will spin just a bit faster, then coasting in D.

 

In an earlier post in this thread, someone mentioned that the double tap didn't help with going EV quicker. Just the opposite on my 08 FEH AWD. The double-tap at 40-41 will always force EV mode, assuming SoC & OK, and water temp is above 140F.

Shifting to Low Gear does the same thing, but the abundant Regen shifting into low causes a lot of loss of speed, and doesn't get to EV any quicker. With only about 2K miles on the car, things will probably change with time. But in the interim, the double-tap is my 1st choice.

But I really like fuel cut-off going down long hills at higher speeds. Zero fuel consumption at 60 or so mph is even better than EV mode at 35mph, because you are going faster while consuming nothing. Ain't technology great!!