08 Ford Escape not going into EV mode
Active Enthusiast
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 118
From: Near Seattle Washington
Re: 08 Ford Escape not going into EV mode
Welcome back.
Manufacturers have limited data on post-warranty failures. If a battery is replaced in the aftermarket with a reconditioned pack, then it didn't fail from the manufacturer's perspective because they have no data.
Notion of "failure" is not in question. If a battery can't perform the duties required of it in a car, then it has failed.
Failures generally result from:
1) shorted cell(s) (pure shorts or partial shorts causing rapid self-discharge)
2) high resistance cell(s)
3) capacity loss below operating threshold.
What the vast majority of consumers don't see is that their 150K mile battery is severely deteriorated with 40-50% of its available capacity remaining - this is still plenty of capacity for normal driving unless frequent and rapid elevation changes are part of normal driving. This is LEAST true of the 05-09 FEH/MMH with it's A/C cooled battery.
Manufacturers have limited data on post-warranty failures. If a battery is replaced in the aftermarket with a reconditioned pack, then it didn't fail from the manufacturer's perspective because they have no data.
Notion of "failure" is not in question. If a battery can't perform the duties required of it in a car, then it has failed.
Failures generally result from:
1) shorted cell(s) (pure shorts or partial shorts causing rapid self-discharge)
2) high resistance cell(s)
3) capacity loss below operating threshold.
What the vast majority of consumers don't see is that their 150K mile battery is severely deteriorated with 40-50% of its available capacity remaining - this is still plenty of capacity for normal driving unless frequent and rapid elevation changes are part of normal driving. This is LEAST true of the 05-09 FEH/MMH with it's A/C cooled battery.
We just bought a 2020 FEH Titanium. So far the car surpasses my expectations in pretty much every way. Hopefully the longevity will be similar to the original breed.
Hybrid and Ethanol Expert
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,616
From: All over the Central U.S.
Re: 08 Ford Escape not going into EV mode
In older cars, lack of EV is very likely due to battery temperature. As they age, internal resistance goes up, and the cells warm quickly. Even on a 50'F day. Our 2005 FEH would trigger the air conditioning to come on after 15 minutes of city driving on a 50'F day.
Performance was the same at 14 years old and 234,000 miles, except for the extra gas used to spin the A/C compressor.
Remember: these early generation cars only utilize ~17% of the battery capacity.
(They recharge at 40% SOC and stop charging at 57% SOC.). Thus the battery pack capacity can deteriorate by a whopping 83% and the car should remain useable.
Battery "capacity" is almost never the reason behind drivability issues.
Performance was the same at 14 years old and 234,000 miles, except for the extra gas used to spin the A/C compressor.
Remember: these early generation cars only utilize ~17% of the battery capacity.
(They recharge at 40% SOC and stop charging at 57% SOC.). Thus the battery pack capacity can deteriorate by a whopping 83% and the car should remain useable.
Battery "capacity" is almost never the reason behind drivability issues.
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Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 5,219
From: Mesa, AZ
Re: 08 Ford Escape not going into EV mode
In older cars, lack of EV is very likely due to battery temperature. As they age, internal resistance goes up, and the cells warm quickly. Even on a 50'F day. Our 2005 FEH would trigger the air conditioning to come on after 15 minutes of city driving on a 50'F day.
Performance was the same at 14 years old and 234,000 miles, except for the extra gas used to spin the A/C compressor.
Remember: these early generation cars only utilize ~17% of the battery capacity.
(They recharge at 40% SOC and stop charging at 57% SOC.). Thus the battery pack capacity can deteriorate by a whopping 83% and the car should remain useable.
Battery "capacity" is almost never the reason behind drivability issues.
Performance was the same at 14 years old and 234,000 miles, except for the extra gas used to spin the A/C compressor.
Remember: these early generation cars only utilize ~17% of the battery capacity.
(They recharge at 40% SOC and stop charging at 57% SOC.). Thus the battery pack capacity can deteriorate by a whopping 83% and the car should remain useable.
Battery "capacity" is almost never the reason behind drivability issues.
They utilize 17% of a NEW battery or about 1Ah for optimal function. As the battery capacity degrades, The "17%" represents less and less actual capacity.
Somewhere around 40% of rated capacity. the 400mAh of available capacity is no longer sufficient to provide acceptable performance. There will be diminished performance in both drivability and economy. A P0A80 will be lurking in that region as well.
Hybrid and Ethanol Expert
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,616
From: All over the Central U.S.
Re: 08 Ford Escape not going into EV mode
This is flawed logic.
They utilize 17% of a NEW battery or about 1Ah for optimal function. As the battery capacity degrades, The "17%" represents less and less actual capacity.
Somewhere around 40% of rated capacity. the 400mAh of available capacity is no longer sufficient to provide acceptable performance. There will be diminished performance in both drivability and economy. A P0A80 will be lurking in that region as well.
They utilize 17% of a NEW battery or about 1Ah for optimal function. As the battery capacity degrades, The "17%" represents less and less actual capacity.
Somewhere around 40% of rated capacity. the 400mAh of available capacity is no longer sufficient to provide acceptable performance. There will be diminished performance in both drivability and economy. A P0A80 will be lurking in that region as well.
No. That is not what we see.
The amp-hours (watt hours, if you like) used in EV mode had remained CONSTANT over 15 years of use.
So yes, the car uses 17% of what's possible when new.
The car uses the same amp-hours always: so probably uses 35% of what's possible at 10 years, 50% of what's there at 15 years, etc.
The percent SOC is just a calculated value, not something tangible or measurable. So yes, a 10% drop at 15 years old does not mean the same thing as a 10% drop when new.
It would be more correct to call it an amp hour drop (or watt hour drop).
Proof: when new I could drive 1 mile in EV on flat road at 25 mph.
At 14 years old I could drive 1 mile in EV on flat road at 25 mph.
Both cases the "guess o meter" displayed a 17% SOC drop.
Last edited by gpsman1; Oct 14, 2020 at 12:25 PM.
Super Moderator
Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 5,219
From: Mesa, AZ
Re: 08 Ford Escape not going into EV mode
SoC is a calculated value based on temperature, voltage and current and an experimentally derived lookup table. It's constant throughout a battery's life. 50% SoC means the battery has 50% of it's capacity remaining, regardless of the rating.
The only way a hybrid uses the same Wh/Ah between two SoC is if the battery capacity remains constant. I have dozens and dozens of in-car discharge tests showing variable Wh/Ah utilization between the same two SoC. Dr. Prius/Hybrid Assistant uses this fact to estimate an installed pack's remaining capacity.
Example:
50% SoC means a new battery has 2.75Ah of capacity remaining. It uses 1Ah between the two SoC limits.
50% SoC on a battery with only 50% of rated capacity has 1.375Ah remaining. It uses 0.5Ah between the two SoC limits.
The only things your "Proof" indicates are:
The only way a hybrid uses the same Wh/Ah between two SoC is if the battery capacity remains constant. I have dozens and dozens of in-car discharge tests showing variable Wh/Ah utilization between the same two SoC. Dr. Prius/Hybrid Assistant uses this fact to estimate an installed pack's remaining capacity.
Example:
50% SoC means a new battery has 2.75Ah of capacity remaining. It uses 1Ah between the two SoC limits.
50% SoC on a battery with only 50% of rated capacity has 1.375Ah remaining. It uses 0.5Ah between the two SoC limits.
The only things your "Proof" indicates are:
- your test was so unscientific, results are meaningless. You failed to control the other variables - such as same course, same speed, same temperatures, etc.
- your battery experienced negligible capacity loss over the course of its life. This is actually very reasonable for these A/C cooled batteries. The exact same Sanyo cells get completely trashed in the HCH2 due to their pathetic cooing system.
Active Enthusiast
Joined: Apr 2019
Posts: 185
Re: 08 Ford Escape not going into EV mode
The fact that my neighbor's had already developed a noticeable amount of play at 180,000km means that only going through 2 by 760,000km is pretty good in comparison. I didn't know it was a common thing until we brought my neighbor's Escape to Ford and the service advisor immediately knew what we were talking about and said yeah it's a frequently seen issue in these. I don't remember the bill but it wasn't obnoxiously expensive to fix.
I will admit though that I sometimes do get SSN, although quite rarely, maybe once a month if that. Happens when driving at low speeds in EV mode, I will get SSN and the car gets stuck in EV. Even if I floor it, the ICE will not come on. If I turn the car off and back on however, it's right back to normal again. Only real "issue" I've noticed so far.
I will admit though that I sometimes do get SSN, although quite rarely, maybe once a month if that. Happens when driving at low speeds in EV mode, I will get SSN and the car gets stuck in EV. Even if I floor it, the ICE will not come on. If I turn the car off and back on however, it's right back to normal again. Only real "issue" I've noticed so far.
Enthusiast
Joined: Jul 2023
Posts: 2
Re: 08 Ford Escape not going into EV mode
Yes, the 12V battery will impact drivetrain characteristics. If you don't know it's condition buy a new one.
The auxiliary cooling air filter is in the cargo area, under a small pop-out panel on the driver's side wall, about a foot above the floor. You probably need one.
Under that is a motor assembly that opens the AC duct to the battery. These often fail. replacing it takes about an hour, and it costs $20.
Another common cause of poor EV performance is a defective coolant thermostat. If the coolant isn't warming up to 180 you won't see much EV action, and fuel economy will suffer.
The auxiliary cooling air filter is in the cargo area, under a small pop-out panel on the driver's side wall, about a foot above the floor. You probably need one.
Under that is a motor assembly that opens the AC duct to the battery. These often fail. replacing it takes about an hour, and it costs $20.
Another common cause of poor EV performance is a defective coolant thermostat. If the coolant isn't warming up to 180 you won't see much EV action, and fuel economy will suffer.
hi. I’m hoping someone is still monitoring this thread.
I am having the exact same issues with my 08. The assist works but it does not drop into electric mode no matter what I do (eco mode , etc)
I am going to replace the battery air filter and blend door accentuator and use FORscan to reset the battery levels , etc as mentioned in this thread.
I do however have a check engine light on which says my engine coolant isn’t reaching optimal levels. Reading on this leads me to understand that the ev won’t function properly if the engine coolant is not correct temp.
now my question is this. Changing the coolant thermo stat is recommended on this thread but is there an engine coolant thermo stat and an ev battery coolant thermostat? Or what the thread talks about is just the engine coolant thermostat?
thoughts?
thanks
Ridiculously Active Enthusiast
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 570
Re: 08 Ford Escape not going into EV mode
That happened to me when my '06's thermostat failed open.
Enthusiast
Joined: Jul 2023
Posts: 2
Re: 08 Ford Escape not going into EV mode
that fixed it m. Thanks for the help
