Google PHEV Solar Project
#11
Re: Google PHEV Solar Project
Already do! Google has implemented their own public transit system to make up for the gaps in what the San Francisco Bay area does not provide. The Google Shuttles were created and routed by Google employees, and are continually remapped as the company grows to better meet the needs of its workers - by the workers.
Smartly, most of the shuttle buses are Wifi-enabled, so you can get onto the Google internal network from the moment you get on the bus - or if you're very aggressive, from the moment the bus gets close to where you're waiting for it.
Admittedly, the Shuttle is not perfect - I would say its schedule does not meet its current demand - for example, some routes don't run late, which causes many employees to avoid it on the worry they may need to stay late that evening.
Personally I prefer biking to work because I'm less than 5 miles out, and at least this month, every day is a perfect day to bike. It's 70 every day and it doesn't rain. I'm sure I'll rethink this in Winter, however.
Smartly, most of the shuttle buses are Wifi-enabled, so you can get onto the Google internal network from the moment you get on the bus - or if you're very aggressive, from the moment the bus gets close to where you're waiting for it.
Admittedly, the Shuttle is not perfect - I would say its schedule does not meet its current demand - for example, some routes don't run late, which causes many employees to avoid it on the worry they may need to stay late that evening.
Personally I prefer biking to work because I'm less than 5 miles out, and at least this month, every day is a perfect day to bike. It's 70 every day and it doesn't rain. I'm sure I'll rethink this in Winter, however.
#12
Re: Google PHEV Solar Project
Maybe one day I might be able to work for a company that provides shutter.
Right now, my employer is strategically making / forcing employees to work from home. For multiple reasons, I just don't have much faith to believe it's due to high gas price and emission.
There was a period of time, when I used to live about 2 miles away from campus, I walked to work in summer time. Couldn't do winter time because it gets dark early and stupid city planning took out the pavement that winter, it became too dangerous to walk that street while those vehicles passing you in 50 MPH...
Anyway, we do what we can base on what we have.
Right now, my employer is strategically making / forcing employees to work from home. For multiple reasons, I just don't have much faith to believe it's due to high gas price and emission.
There was a period of time, when I used to live about 2 miles away from campus, I walked to work in summer time. Couldn't do winter time because it gets dark early and stupid city planning took out the pavement that winter, it became too dangerous to walk that street while those vehicles passing you in 50 MPH...
Anyway, we do what we can base on what we have.
#13
Re: Google PHEV Solar Project
Under those conditions, 40mpg is not bad.
#14
Re: Google PHEV Solar Project
I wonder if anyone has data on non-hybrid midsize cars' actual mileage in that area - it'd be nice to compare apples to apples.
#15
Re: Google PHEV Solar Project
Well, by way of comparison, I also have a Saab 9-5 with a 2.3L 4cyl, turbo, 5-spd. When I lived on the Peninsula, I could barely get my rolling average above 21 mpg, and that was about 50/50 local and freeway, but the hills and traffic lights just kill the mileage when you are in town. You should see what SUV and truck drivers get - 10-12 mpg in most cases.
Out here in Sacramento, where it is more open and flat, my average mileage immediately jumped to 25, and it is now at 27 since I use the Prius for commuting and the Saab mostly for longer drives. My gut feel is the congested, hilly Bay Area will cost almost any vehicle about 20-25% in mileage. A hybrid probably loses half that, which would fit with the 40mpg they were getting.
Out here in Sacramento, where it is more open and flat, my average mileage immediately jumped to 25, and it is now at 27 since I use the Prius for commuting and the Saab mostly for longer drives. My gut feel is the congested, hilly Bay Area will cost almost any vehicle about 20-25% in mileage. A hybrid probably loses half that, which would fit with the 40mpg they were getting.
#16
Re: Google PHEV Solar Project
The MPG killer for me in the Bay Area has been the traffic lights. In LA, I was spoiled by lights that run on a schedule and blink the Don't Walk sign for a consistent amount of time before turning yellow, so I could decide when to Glide, when to Pulse, easily.
Here in the Bay Area, every single light is on a sensor and they have very short intervals that they'll wait between cars. So, if I leave Google at 9 or 10pm when there's the least traffic - normally a good condition for P&G - lights will randomly turn yellow right in front of me because the car flipped the sensor, and there's no Don't Walk sign blink to help me predict. Driving home from Google has gotten as low as 55mpg and as high as 70mpg because of traffic light predictability alone and that 70mpg was just one lucky drive home with only one sudden light change.
It's funny how the Bay Area's push to add sensor technology has hammered my gas efficiency. Even when we move from Hybrids to Electric cars, the inability to easily maintain momentum will still kill efficiency.
Here in the Bay Area, every single light is on a sensor and they have very short intervals that they'll wait between cars. So, if I leave Google at 9 or 10pm when there's the least traffic - normally a good condition for P&G - lights will randomly turn yellow right in front of me because the car flipped the sensor, and there's no Don't Walk sign blink to help me predict. Driving home from Google has gotten as low as 55mpg and as high as 70mpg because of traffic light predictability alone and that 70mpg was just one lucky drive home with only one sudden light change.
It's funny how the Bay Area's push to add sensor technology has hammered my gas efficiency. Even when we move from Hybrids to Electric cars, the inability to easily maintain momentum will still kill efficiency.
#17
Re: Google PHEV Solar Project
Excellent data (especially on the Saab) - thanks folks!
A couple of points that this discussion triggers for me.
1) I have always figured the performance of hybrids relative to conventional cars would increase even more in hilly / mountainous terrain, as conventional cars are forced to throw away of a lot of energy that the hybrids recycle through downhill regen braking. While neither will likely do as well as they do on nearly flat ground, the hybrid bonus over the conventional should increase, it seems to me. Comments from anyone in the mountains proper?
2) Increased fuel economy is typically used as a major argument for switching _to_ timed traffic lights in a city. I am interested to hear the reason(s) that the Bay Area switched away from them - customer demand / frustration waiting for lights that are green for nonexistent cross-traffic, perhaps?
A couple of points that this discussion triggers for me.
1) I have always figured the performance of hybrids relative to conventional cars would increase even more in hilly / mountainous terrain, as conventional cars are forced to throw away of a lot of energy that the hybrids recycle through downhill regen braking. While neither will likely do as well as they do on nearly flat ground, the hybrid bonus over the conventional should increase, it seems to me. Comments from anyone in the mountains proper?
2) Increased fuel economy is typically used as a major argument for switching _to_ timed traffic lights in a city. I am interested to hear the reason(s) that the Bay Area switched away from them - customer demand / frustration waiting for lights that are green for nonexistent cross-traffic, perhaps?
#18
Re: Google PHEV Solar Project
SoopahMan- as someone who biked through four Palo Alto 'winters' I'd have to put in as my opinion that it is really one of the easiest places in the world to bicycle year-round. The weather just never gets to the point where you can't be comfortable wearing a coat and riding a bike. It may get a little gray out there, and there will probably be a couple of weeks of rain at some point in February or so, but if your bike has fenders to keep your back from getting splashed, it just isn't much of an issue. Speaking from experience, I predict that you'll stick with the bike.
#19
Re: Google PHEV Solar Project
However, there is a section of mountain on the way to Santa Cruz here that does something a little interesting: It rolls down for a while then up for just a little, then down again. This ends up giving me an uphill to empty the battery so it has room for the second section. That probably does help MPG a lot.
That said, the uphill portion is absolute murder on the poor little Prius gas engine. It usually can't do more than 45mph without sounding like it's redlining, and running it in those higher RPM ranges for a really long time as it slowly drags up the mountainside is bad for efficiency. It's well past the ideal part of the torque curve.
One last major problem with hills and mountains is a nice big red light at the bottom of every hill. The best way to get good MPG is maintaining momentum, not filling up your battery. A good hybrid driver could take that downhill and leave the car off the whole way down and halfway up the next hill, but instead you end up using your friction brakes (power wasted) to come to a complete stop and start all over. Take the red light away and you've got an ideal hybrid track though.
I'd be really interested why these sensor lights are out here too. I've at least learned to watch carefully for cars pulling up to the intersection coming the other way, since that's my warning it's gonna go yellow.
I'd love a bike recommendation around here - I got a $100 7-speed from Target and the back tire's already flat and it's already thrown a chain in just 3 uses. I'm not getting any biking done on that rolling disaster!
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