I am all for the GM hybrid technology spreading to other makers. If the technology is to become prevalent then these other companies need to get into the game and from the article it looks like they view the deals with GM as allowing them to catch up. I certainly don't think they will all follow GM's lead though. They will make their own changes and modifications to the system to allow them to tune it for their models and to also not be strapped to paying GM for every hybrid they turn out.
Although in light of the current GM problems they could use all the $$ they can get.

 

"My understanding was the first Prius was introduced in Japan in 1997."

Probably so. They imported it to the U.S. in '99 or '00. But that first generation Prius was completely different than today's Prius.

It was tiny. I remember sitting in one at a Toyota dealer back in 2000, and refusing to test drive it because I couldn't fit into it. Plus, it looked like an Echo at the time, which created a down-market perception of the car.

Most of all, it was just a gee-whiz techno car at the time, because it cost $20,000 and gasoline was $1.25 per gallon. Payback period was longer than life itself.

Today's Prius compares to the first Prius the way a 2008 Corolla compares to a 1988 Corolla -- same name, completely different car.

 

When I was shopping for a car a year ago, I went to my local ford dealer, who we've dealt with for 20+ years. They told me not to buy an escape, and that they are not selling them anyway. They were "city cars".

Hmmm...4wd, SUV...city car??

We got the HCH.

 

Translation......"We don't have any. Darn sure wish we did, but we don't and I have no clue when we'll get more. So now I have to convince you that what you REALLY want is something else that I have on my lot"

 

Good translation Martin.
I made a similar translation when I was thinking about replacing my Ranger with and Escape hybrid.....but my interpretation was slightly different, it was....We don't have any Escape hybrids and we are not going to even try to get one as long as we have the gassers....buy what we have or nothing....I chose nothing, not really great way for business to keep their doors open.

 

Heh, could be, but like I said we've been loyal ford buyers for years. The owner said that they were being discouraged to sell the escape hybrids, they were to go to the big cities instead of out in rural areas where I am.

Besides I don't need a SUV and wasn't interested in the escape hybrid after I read the numbers.

Ford Escape Hybrid starts at $31,000 gets 6.7 l / 100 km highway, 5.7 l /100 km city (ford website) (my 07 hch is rated at 4.3 l/100 km highway we get ~ 4.5 in the summer, 5.8 winter)

So in part they were correct, it actually gets better economy in city driving vs highway

I am rural, 90% of my driving is highway, 40 k per year, 4 people in the car most times - wife and two kids.

So I am back to why would I want a SUV that's designed for city driving? It's like the honda accord hybrid...its a hybrid, but it's not green, it was designed to go faster, not have more economy - they no longer make it. It just doesn't make sense from a practical economy point of view.

But where are the ford civic or prius equivalents? We had a ford focus (2001 wagon), after putting in $70 a week in gas (@ 1.12 /l at the time) plus all the @#$#$ repairs on the darn thing, I got rid of it and got the honda and spend 35 week in gas @ 1.43 now *gasp* - still have the repairs though, our 2007 has had alot of problems - no cost to us, but has taken up quite a bit of time)

If they had a practical hybrid I probably would have bought it from them, but now I have a honda import after 20 yrs+ of buying ford.

 

I live in a city of just under 1 million people. I do not off-road. For the most part I do not tow. I do use the tow hitch for a 4-bike, hitch mounted bike rack.

The best fit vehicle for me, of those that are on the market, would probably be either a Saturn VUE Greenline or a Buick Enclave.

My family drives on vacations a lot, so I need something that can carry 4 or more people while also carrying luggage and bicycles and golf clubs. I also need something capable of carrying one or two 100 pound dogs on semi-frequent trips to parks, vets, pet supply stores, and sometimes on the driving vacations. Since I live in the snowbelt, FWD or AWD are a strong preference.

The VUE seats 5, as does the FEH. The Enclave seats 7. Both get pretty good gas mileage, especially for their class of vehicle. The Enclave is very luxurious and has a number of options that make long roadtrips bearable.

I don't think that I am alone as an urban dweller who uses CUVs or SUVs as people haulers.

Peace,

Martin

 

You know what they say, never say never (or ever, ever).

While I would of course agree that Toyota's HSD is awesome and also that GM is generally behind when it comes to fuel efficiency it is clear that GM is changing. That two-mode tranny is awesome for people that need to actually use a truck for pulling heavy things. The Volt is going to be amazing.

Right now the Vette is simultaneously one of the most powerful sports cars and one of the best mileage sports cars you can buy. Little Japanese sports cars like the S2000 (18/25mpg, 235hp) and the RX8 (16/23mpg, 212hp) have less power (a lot less) and get worse mileage. The Vette (16/26mpg, 430hp) is an awesome combination of power and relative efficiency.

Writing off GM completely for ever and ever is just silly.

Does Toyota even make a sports car?

 

They have one coming. Probably will be badged a Lexus, at least in the US. It's been delayed a couple times, but will eventually be launched.

 

Lexus LF-A reported to be coming in the 2010-2011 time frame.




Also there's a rumor that Toyota is working with Subaru to bring a compact rwd sports car in the same 2010/11 timeframe. Could possibly be the return of the Supra.