Hi Philly Dan, thanks for your reply!
It appears from your post and others to this thread that these cars vary from vehichle to vehicle as to the normal battery charge.
You asked:
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Also, if you use AutoStop with the A/C on, the fan will continue to run, blowing cool air for a while.
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As I said earlier, I never use AutoStop, ever, so the AutoStop cannot be any part of the equation.
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Are you sure your driving style didn't change, so you're using Assist more?
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Yes, I'm sure, because what happened is that the battery charge typically ran at 3/4 to full (unless I was climbing a steep hill) until the night the car broke down. Only AFTER the breakdown and tow did the battery start running at 1/2 to 1/4, which is how the car came back to me and has not changed since.

Not only is my driving style consistent, but I drive the exact same roads all the time because I live on an island. There is a variety of terrain here, from in-town to level highway to windy mountainous up-and-down highway, but I have never had to deliberately seek out certain terrain in order to get my battery charged.

The dealer says that this change is not a symptom of the problem they cannot identify that caused the breakdown. I don't see how it could be unrelated. The IMA light came on when the car broke down, and subsequently the IMA system is not functioning the way it did for the last 25000 miles. Common sense alone tells me the chances are high that there may be a connection there, but the dealer refuses to consider that. If there's no connection, it's quite a coincidence.

I am not having any luck with either the dealer or American Honda.
I had the most annoying conversation with an American Honda person yesterday. I will post that seperately.

 

When they towed, did they to it draging the front wheels or where the front wheels up in the air or the car on a flat trailer?

 

OK, this is what I got from American Honda. By the way, both American Honda and the dealer have refused to give me the name or number of any regional manager. Each said I had to go to the other one for such a referral.

American Honda says it is bound by the dealer's decision that the car is OK.
The dealer is saying that American Honda has said that the car is OK.

American Honda suggested I could try another dealer. When I explained that both dealerships on the Big Island of Hawaii are under the same ownership and service manager, and that I would have to ship the car somewhere, possibly even to California at the cost of $2000 in order to have another dealer check it out, the AH rep could not even find the humanity to agree that would hardly be a feasible solution.

Talking to this rep was like talking to a robot or android. When I told him that I felt my life was at risk driving a car that could breakdown so suddenly, he said that Honda is not responsible for what kind of roads I drive on.

When I told him I would hold Honda responsible if my car malfunctions and causes me to be injured, he said that it would not be Honda's fault because Honda does not "want" me to get hurt. I said that by refusing to act, taking back the loaner, and forcing me to drive the car, Honda is putting me at risk.

He then said my next option is to talk to a factory rep at such time they visit the dealership, possibly in a month. At this point I was fed up and said, "you mean, if I'm not in the hospital or dead in a month, I'll be able to talk to someone else." He said, "yes, that's what I mean."

When I told him this was a very unsatisfactory way to be treated, he asked me what I would like Honda to do, I told him that they could try to address the IMA problem with a new battery, for instance. (They could try something based on the codes the car displayed when it broke down; it's not my job to say what exactly, but they could try the most likely culprit. To date they have made no repairs, only run tests and checked to eliminate loose connections.)

This reply is unbelievable:
AH: we can't replace the battery because that would put unnecessary wear and tear on your vehicle, and it's our duty to avoid that for your sake.

Me: I don't understand how replacing a battery would put wear and tear on my car. Please explain.

AH: (throat-clearing) well, that would be a repair, and your car is under factory warranty still, so if we make a repair that would bring your vehicle under the lemon law.

Me: I don't know anything about the lemon law. I want a safe reliable car that I can drive down the road without being concerned and watching the gauges every minute. I cannot believe that Honda is refusing to even try to repair my car in order to cover its *** under the lemon law.

AH: replays broken record of same robotic responses about not "wanting" me to get hurt but there is nothing they can do, and unless the codes come up while the techs are working on it, they have no way to know what IF ANYTHING is wrong with the car. They cannot make a repair based on codes that came up when the car malfunctioned while I was driving it. It has to malfunction for the shop.


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At this point, I would never buy another new Honda. I thought they stood behind their product.

 

I'd say pursue the Lemon Law in your state. That's an option for people who cannot get remedy from the dealer or the manufacturer. You might get a new car out of the deal.....Maybe a 2006 re-designed Civic hybrid?

 

That is really shocking!
I hope you've kept good notes, reciepts, names, dates etc.

If it were me I'd check with an attourney that specializes in the lemon law.

 

Hi All,

I wanted to register just to throw in on this issue. I had bought a used 03 insight that was doing same thing. The original owner only drove the car normally, not trying at all for mileage, AC on constantly. LMPG was 43 (low for an Insight). Car had 10k miles, but would never get past 1/2 soc. With the help of insightcentral I decided to re-set the MCM/BCM computer. It involved removing a fuse, then starting the car, then revving till SOC went to full,then replacing the fuse

It worked!! I only had to do this once for this issue.

Is there a similar procedure for the HCH?

I will dig around and see if I can find the info for an Insight and post it here.

Randy

PS I will be buying a 2006 hch if life (not wife) allows.

 

Ok,I found it.


http://www.insightcentral.net/encycl...enstorage.html

Try this.

 

It almost sounds to me like the breakdown could have been caused by some windings short circuiting in the electric motor or you may have a short somewhere else that is draining the bat's even when the key is off, like a couple of shorted cells. After the short circuit the IMA could be using much too much power which could be why your bat's are always low and never recharge to normal levels. If possible, I would try and monitor the current during IMA usage. Not too many Honda dealerships have the brainpower needed to service these vehicles so you may to search for one that does..

Ralph.

BSEE..

 

sorry I haven't revisited this ... didn't realize there were new replies.

I eventually realized the battery level change wasn't related to why my car broke down. I think the battery charge went down because I moved into town with lots of signals and stops. Before, I made very few short trips; most trips involved highway miles, which keep my car charged up. The car broke down the day I moved, so the two things were intertwined.

What I was really concerned about was why my car suddenly failed on me. Watching the battery was just one aspect of paying attention to the car to see if it was doing anything weird. I also thought it was cutting out and having weird surges where the car would speed up when I hadn't increased the gas, as if it suddenly was getting more fuel. Unfortunately, each time the tech drove it he thought it was fine.

Anyway, but when I got the recall notice I thought, bingo, this is it. I may be wrong, have to wait until next week for an appointment. (oh, and they are not offering loaners for the half day in the shop).

The reason I think this "running lean" might be the problem is that when my car broke down it was acting like the engine was starved for fuel. I lost power, check engine light came on, IMA light came on. It has not done it since, BUT I have to drive it not knowing when the problem will strike again.

I personally am pretty annoyed with Honda because I took my inquiry to the top (through both my dealer and American Honda) and they claimed that the engineers who designed it could not come up with anything that would have made the codes come on. Did Honda factory engineering not have an inkling of this recall coming down the pipeline in mid-April? I find that hard to believe.

Lastly, as several of you recommended, I asked to talk to the regional manager. They wouldn't give me a phone number, but they did set up an appointment that was to be next time he came to my area, six weeks from when my car broke down. The day of my appointment, I got a call asking if I could make my car have the problem when I took it in to meet with him.

I had made it clear when I set up the appointment that I wanted to talk about Honda's inability to diagnose the problem based on tech experience, the codes the breakdown generated. They had information, and they couldn't come up with any theory except that I might be a stupid driver who couldn't tell the difference between auto-stop shut off and having my engine quit on me while driving down the road.

Point being, they all new my car wouldn't break down on cue. So I got a call back saying the regional manager was canceling my appointment I had waited six weeks for because there would be nothing for him to see in the way of a problem.

I'm very disappointed in Honda. I feel they need to deal with the fact that they put a car on the road that was great as long as it ran perfectly, but with insufficient training of techs in the case it malfunctioned, and the manager could have at least had the courtesy to meet with me or speak to me on the phone.

Lastly, as I posted above, American Honda said they could not try any repairs they were unsufe about because of starting the counter on unsuccessful repairs under the lemon law. Well, the lemon law does not apply to my car, because in Hawaii the lemon law is the first 24 months or 24 (or 25)K miles, whichever comes first. My car was 7 months past that when it broke down. So either they don't know their lemon law (possible) or that was a lame excuse.

I hope my catalytic converter is OK. I'll ask them to check it. FWIW, I bought this car in California with California emissions equipment and shipped it to Hawaii.