Yes, this is correct. I was talking with a guy from Honda and he told me this maybe 6 months ago. I forgot about it

 

http://world.honda.com/news/2007/c07...ar-CEO-Speech/
<Hybrid>
· Honda will offer a new dedicated hybrid vehicle in 2009 at a price level lower than the Civic Hybrid.

Ken@Japan

 

I think they are just saying that so you will buy one sooner. I have been seeing more and more hybrids out there, especially in the past 6 mo or so.

 

The only possible Honda cheaper than the Civic is the Fit. It's called the Jazz in other countries, because that's where Honda sold it for years.

So if Honda wants to cram a hybrid system into the Fit, fine. But the price savings won't be that great over the HCH. It might still sell, but Honda will have competition from Hyundai's hybrid, due also in 2009.

Honda will have to offer something special to keep the newer, cheaper hybrid from suffering the same fate as the Accord hybrid. I'm sure heads are rolling over THAT marketing mistake.

 

It will not be a Fit, although it obviously could be based roughly on the Fit platform. The word is that it will not share a body with a gas model because of the thought that one of the reasons the Prius is so successful is because it flashes "hybrid" in 12 foot tall neon letters (well, you know what I mean).

 

I thought the reason the Prius (and all the HSD-equipped Toyotas) are selling so well is the sheer superior hybrid system, which will lend itself to many variations, both car and truck based and a plug-in system to extend fuel-efficiency and lower emissions.

I'll admit i like the 'look' of the Civic hybrid, but I LOVE what my Prius does. Looks are subjective. Overall, the Prius just does everything well: high efficiency, low emissions, carry cargo and people in a easy to drive/park attractive design that can be bought by most incomes. It appeals to so many on many levels. It just performs like a car should in today's market (need higher efficiency, lower emissions, ability to haul cargo and people, decent price,etc.)

 

That might have a little to do with it, but there has been a TON of marketing done on the Prius. There has been almost zero marketing done on the HCHII, and the ads that I've seen also have other Hondas picture touting Honda's overall fuel efficiency. I also notice a lot more media mentions about the Prius than the HCH.

The bottom line is that the Prius has a better hybrid system but the HCHII has a much better engine. Overall FE is within 1mpg in the database between the two cars so both systems work very well, but the IMA is more suited to smaller cars whereas the HSD is more scalable. The problem with putting HSD on larger vehicles is that the large number of batteries and powerful motors that are requried for big vehicles cost a lot. That will make the gas/hybrid differential greater and it might be harder for "mainstream" buyers to justify the difference. I'm curious to see what happens to Toyota's sales when their Federal tax credit finally disappears in October.

The "non-mainstream" buyers generally don't seem to be interested in driving a truck or SUV--they want something REALLY fuel efficient which is always going to be a small car. I think Honda's strategy could pay off well for them.

 

Honda, just like Toyota was doing (not too long ago), is providing much better allocations for most of the US than it does for all other markets outside the US. Let's face it, hybrids vehicles still remain the rage in North America more so than many other markets. So the US market is that relevant.

There are reports of extreme long waiting lists for South Africa, Australia and many other markets where the demand is high but the supply is frustratingly low.

So, yes, the allocation is definetely not even at all. It can be misleading to assume that the there's no problem with supply simply because they may be plenty in one area but lacking severely elsewhere. What can you expect, 38,000 units per year for the whole world market? Not enough.

Cheers;

MSantos

 

That has a good element of truth... but it is also typical of the regurgitations of elitism commonly typical of many Prius chat members. I am sure, that if some of these folks owned both cars, the perceived superiority of the Prius would not be as dramatic.

However, the reason why (I believe) the Prius sells so well is not only because it is has one heck of a good system with better (not perfect) scalability, but instead, because Toyota is a mighty industrial machine with unparalleled ability to ramp up production as it sees fit. In this case they had a great HSD design philosophy tied in with relentless and coordinated marketing, and the Production capability to back it up.
That is in my view the big picture explanation why the Prius is doing so well.

If you recall, the HSD (Prius II) did not see many changes since its intro in 2004 and the early low sales numbers only fueled the hybrid sceptics that hybrids did not sell. In fact at that time Toyota was limited in capacity and had long waiting lists. Now fast forward a couple of years after Toyota dramatically ramped up production. Amazing isn't it?

Cheers;

MSantos

 

Not being able to own but two cars in our household and driving a HCH II (just a days worth, so I will admit a short relationship!), the Prius just outperforms the HCH II in the ways I need a car to perform: great efficiency, low emissions, HAUL CARGO (big one here as everyone knows the limits on the non-folding rear seat in the HCH II), haul people, overall coolness factor, and competant in the passing lane. Oh, and just a joy, just plain fun to drive. The HCH II did a few of these things for me (again, a rather short testing phase). the Prius did ALL of them so well, it was, to me a no brainer.

I will concede that many of these things is subjective and the Prius will not appeal to everyone.

Yes, the pious attitude of PriusChat (and owning a Prius) does rear it's head in my case. I had the same arttitude when riding my old Harley. Now it's just quieter and better smelling!