Chevy - Volt - What am I missing here????
 

So everyone seems to in awe of the new Chevy Volt concept from GM. I just don't get the excitment, other than an american car company is at least trying to develop "home grown" innovation rather than importing it. Sweep away the mom and apple pie, and the facts make the Volt "Break Through" actually seems very minor. From what I read, the Volt aspires to have the following:

• Approx 50MPG when using the ICE to generate the electricty - I typical get 51MPG in my 1st Generation Honda Civic Hybrid
• 40 miles on Electric only when charged from the 110v plug. Only 6-6.5 hours to make that charge, and last time I checked, the coal fired generating plant that supplies electricity to my area isn't too 'green'. oh - yea - my home electricty isn't 'free' either.
• a 650 mile range using a full 'home charge' and the 12 gallon gas tank - that's about what I get with my 2003 Civic hybrid.
• Seats 4 or 5. yea, so does my Civic, an from the looks of the concept car, the Civic will be more comfortable.
• Revolutional 'flex-fuel' ICE engine. I'm assuming ethanol will decrease the 50 mpg. Also, hasn't GM been producing a Flex-fuel engine for awhile? They cite bio-diesel, but don't mention how - I would assume that it is EITHER gas/ethanol OR BioDiesel. The two systems are so different that I just don't see how a common engine could accomidate both. Diesel uses compression for igintion, Gas/Ethanol need sparks. Diesel compression ratios in the hundreds, Gas/ethanol is lucky to get 9:1. Diesel would probably increase the 50 mph however.
• Lithium Batter Packs - Gm says 'should get' 10 years out of them. Estimated replacement cost is $10,000. Sounds like a 'disposable' car. Who is going to sink $10k into a 10 year old car???
• All electric drive train - sounds cool, but you have to ask 'So what?'. Maybe more reliable, but $10k to replace the battery in 10years negates that savings.
• 0-60 in a little over 8.5 seconds - Doesn't the Prius do it in a little UNDER 8.5?

Don't get me wrong - I'm happy to see GM trying to introduce innovation and engineering to the automotive world, and they do have some interesting ideas, such as the composite body with recycled content. Good start, but not an earth shattering concept. Plus I doubt they will continue that with the production model.

In short, it's a good start, but no 'pardigm shift'. I think I'll wait for the next generation Prius. I'd love for someone to explain to me why the Volt will be better than the next Prius - I qualify for the GM Employee discount but currently own two Hondas.

Re: Chevy - Volt - What am I missing here????
 

Hi,

I think there is merit in many of your points. The most obvious one not stated is the Volt remains "PowerPoint" engineering, not a real product on the floor. Today's GM hybrid offering are: (1) Silverado, (2) Saturn SUV Green, and (3) hybrid busses:

I agree with you about the MPG but it needs to be 'averaged' with the electric vehicle mode mileage. Of course, this also means we need some way to deal with the cost of home electricity versus gas pump. The best answer is to go to a 'cost per mile' scale instead of MPG.

As a general rule, the coal fired plant electricity will be about 1/3d the cost per mile of the gasoline equivalent. This of course will change once folks realize there needs to be some sort of 'road tax' to cover paving and bridge repairs. But still, the consumer cost will be less than gasoline and we won't have to import the coal.

The 'flex-fuel' bothers me because the 2001 Precept concept car used a 3-cylinder, diesel engine. Why they went to a gas engine does not yet make sense unless they really can't figure out how to clean-up diesel exhaust in small engines.

The battery life argument no longer impresses me. As time goes on, we are learning more and more about proper battery management. Also, it looks like some of the assumptions about the ability to refurbish NiMH batteries may be wrong. The same may be true for properly designed LI battery technology.

I can't really answer about creature comforts and performance. In theory, an all electric car will 'shutdown' any fuel driven vehicle in a sprint. The major risk being torque shearing the shaft at low RPMs. But this is something for another discussion in another place.

So as a fine piece of "PowerPoint" engineering, the Volt sounds good . . . as does any 'press release' vehicle. When it hits the showroom floors, we'll be able to find out if it is real. Certainly the Tesla vehicle suggests it can be done.

Bob Wilson

Re: Chevy - Volt - What am I missing here????
 

I guess my point is - Where's the Innovation? Whats the 'break through'? Why are we better off because of the Chevy Volt (aside from the made in America factor). All Electric drive and Plug in seems to be the only diviation from the 10 year old Prius technology, and I don't see a significant benefit from it. Certainly not equal to the all the hype it has been receiving.

Re: Chevy - Volt - What am I missing here????
 

the volt is classic GM smoke and mirrors.

They will eventually claim its too expensive to produce or claim there is no demand. Or doom it to failure by making it ridiculous. I think all 3 will happen.

with the battery pack they claim they are doing very poorly at utilizing it.

my opinion is that this car was made because they realized they are at the back of the race into the future of automobiles and energy. They used to be powerful enough to control this in the past, but their bad behavior for the last 100 years is catching up.

I for still hope they make an EV or PEHV. But only if they are seriously trying to be competitive. Up to this point anything they have done in this arena has been to prove that it cant be done to various governments.

Please read the book "Internal Combustion"

Re: Chevy - Volt - What am I missing here????
 

Even from coal, electric produces less CO2 than gasoline. However, from your post it sounds like your main concern is financial.

Even when paying 10 cents per kWh, electric per mile costs are half that of gasoline per mile costs at 50 mpg.

Fuel costs are free if you make your own electricity at home.

Re: Chevy - Volt - What am I missing here????
 

Points are well taken when you consider the bottom lines. Couple comments:

#1: Only 50 MPG when driving on one tank of gas without a recharge. It's the 40 miles on electric that can make the big difference. With my commute, I'd probably go two months on a tank. Don't forget to compare emissions - with the all-electric, emmissions are significantly less than the Honda.
#2: Data I've seen shows about $1 / day to charge. Also, in some states (like mine) a vast majority (~70%) of electricity is hydro, not fossil fuel.
#3: Agreed. But, I can count on one hand the number of times I've driven more than 300 miles in one sitting in my Honda. Opps, make that no hands. It just doesn't come up that often (for me).

Anyway, apples to apples I suppose it's not a revolution. Cost-wise, if I charged it 20 times a month and used one tank of gas per month, that's the same cost as my Civic (uses 2 tanks / month). But, emissions are better. And, I just think it's cool - it's interesting - it's different. It also paves the way for better versions of it.

I did read in my C&D last month that the editors estimated the lithium packs in the Volt are probably $16,000 per at today's prices. They felt that before the Volt could be cost-effective / profitable to produce, that number would have to be more like $2,000.