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Re: TC and F/awd vehicles.
Originally Posted by wwest
(Post 206310)
The earliest versions apparently had over-heating problems/issues This has not been documented by Willard and he only assumes it was an issue. |
Re: TC and F/awd vehicles.
The cited section, 4wd systems, does not apply to the hybrid Escape.
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Re: TC and F/awd vehicles.
Originally Posted by Bill Winney
(Post 206336)
The cited section, 4wd systems, does not apply to the hybrid Escape.
The 2009 Escape/Mariner/Escape Hybrid WorkShop Manual contains no special 4WD for Hybrid section. Are you looking at the 2006 Escape/Mariner/Escape Hybrid Workshop Manual as listed at Helm, Inc? |
Re: TC and F/awd vehicles.
Yes, I purchased my manuals from Helm, Inc. and are copyrighted by Ford Motor Company.
Go take a look at the index... the section he cited is under the heading of Escapes with "manual transmission, clutch, and transfer case." I am sure those options weren't available in '06 for the hybrid. The correct citation should have come from section 205. Go take a look. |
Re: TC and F/awd vehicles.
Originally Posted by Bill Winney
(Post 206349)
Yes, I purchased my manuals from Helm, Inc. and are copyrighted by Ford Motor Company.
Go take a look at the index... the section he cited is under the heading of Escapes with "manual transmission, clutch, and transfer case." I am sure those options weren't available in '06 for the hybrid. The correct citation should have come from section 205. Go take a look. You haven't replied why you think that the 4WD section doesn't apply to a FEH. No 4WD in '06? |
Re: TC and F/awd vehicles.
Originally Posted by wptski
(Post 206313)
Where did you get the info about the 0-50% rear wheel torque? Nothing is explained in detail in the shop manuals about this at all.
This dual clutch (electromagnetic/mechanical) driveline coupling technique is now quite widely used, Mazda, Ford, Toyota (Venza), Lexus (2010 RX350), and Porsche's new 2010 911. My "knowledge" is a compilation of all the information across the board. The manual states that there is temperature sensing of the ATC unit and if an increae is sensed, it goes into a "locked mode"(not explained). If the rear driveline clutch is fully engaged, LOCKED, no clutch slippage, then there will no heat generated within the clutch itself. If temperature still incrases in "locked mode" the ATC is disabled and you must leave the vehicle running for tem minutes for it to cool down. Nothing is mentioned about how you know if it's in the "locked mode" or ATC has been disabled! |
Re: TC and F/awd vehicles.
Originally Posted by wwest
(Post 206353)
I thought that the temperature sensing of the clutch only applied to earlier models.
That's from a '09 FE/MM/FEH/MMH WorkShop Manual. |
Re: TC and F/awd vehicles.
Originally Posted by wptski
(Post 204127)
What does a FEH or owning one have to do with TC/AWD?
Thus, owning an FEH means one has the documentation and driving experience to share with other FEH owners about Ford products. wwest tends to spout Toyota information in the FEH threads, which is why he is on my ignore list - I cannot trust that any information he provides definitively applies to the FEH as opposed to the HSD. |
Re: TC and F/awd vehicles.
Originally Posted by stevedebi
(Post 207307)
The Ford implementation of AWD is very different from Toyota, and the TC programming is also different. Ford developed their software and hardware separately from Toyota; although the two concepts are similar, the implementation is different.
Thus, owning an FEH means one has the documentation and driving experience to share with other FEH owners about Ford products. wwest tends to spout Toyota information in the FEH threads, which is why he is on my ignore list - I cannot trust that any information he provides definitively applies to the FEH as opposed to the HSD. I "think" but not positive that several manufacturers including Ford is using the same ATC unit in their rearends, well actually whoever builds the rearends for Ford. Why do you have to list the people on your ignore list in the open???? |
Re: TC and F/awd vehicles.
Originally Posted by wptski
(Post 207321)
Hey, if you have inside information on the Ford 4WD/AWD and know how it works exactly, please let me know. I've email Ford, they said get the manuals or go to your dealer. The books don't explain the amount of rear wheel torque under normal driving conditions. I stumped two service techs and the service manager last week. The service manager aggreed to call their Tech HotLine. They called back and said nothing more than what's been printed and also said that there are no published specs on what I asked!! Somebody knows because somebody designed it!
I "think" but not positive that several manufacturers including Ford is using the same ATC unit in their rearends, well actually whoever builds the rearends for Ford. Why do you have to list the people on your ignore list in the open???? The interesting thing about the FEH (as opposed to the Toyota) Hybrid AWD systems is that it is identical mechanically to the non hybrid. The Toyotas use individual electric drives on the rear wheel, which can over heat and shut down (although this seldom happens in the real world, from what I have read). I have a feeling that Ford considers most of it's hybrid programming very secret, and chooses not to produce any documentation that explains their AWD drive routines and how they actually implement the AWD. Of course they publish any maintenance guides required, but that is different from the design of how the system operates. So about all we know is that the sales literature says that it is "intelligent" 4WD and adapts to road conditions, rather than reacts to road conditions. But this is really only implied in the sales literature. |
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